Enel or Kizaru ?

[yoahl]

If there really were Spaceys and moon ruins, then yes I could. They didn't say he started a new complex civilization, he just basically said "I am your god, obey me or die." As for the ruins, Enel was very familiar with all three moon descendants. He also spent time studying ruins before. He didn't need much information from the painting anyway. Maybe just how to run the machine. lol so you can read it. tell me how? lol your genius if you can tell me how? also what about the paintings? can you explain it?

Didn't say I could make the same thing so you dont know how to make maxim? lol how sad enel can haha....

You're assuming the Maxim has complicated blueprints. do you know its blueprints? lol so what do you think about the maxim blueprint? you said with enel power you could make a ship better than maxim wow really? tell me how? if you can your smarter than enel lol...

you seem to downgrade enel knowledge even you compare your self with him hehe thats something

[Sigart]

lessee, to make Maxim.. you need to create a simple motor, but one that can move incredibly fast. The problem as I see it is that while I could possibly make a motor given enough time, I only know how a car motor really works... and Enel uses an electric motor, yes? I don't remember how those works, how to change electric energy into kinetic energy.

But anyway! Uh... what does Enel's ability in building an arc have to do with whether or not he can defeat Kizaru? Ready knowledge is worth nothing except to make a strategy, and Enel has never showed that he uses strategy beyond "use superior df powers". If his df powers are not superior, we have no idea how he will tackle it. Yes, he might attack Kizaru from a distance using mantra, but it's doubtful if that his attack would work on Kizaru in the first place, since Kizaru is not exactly solid.

so it would come down to a face-off, and Enel won't have the time to think if Kizaru attacks. You don't have the time to pause, regroup and figure out a new strategy once the enemy is upon you. I'm not saying Kizaru would do much better in that case, but the fact is that we don't know.

We have too little info on how Kizaru would react if pressured. We know that Enel is good at changing tactics, as he did with Luffy, but there were several places where he showed the weakness of his mantra; he depends on it to a fault. Unlike Lucci, who could reach the trajectory of Luffy's punches, Enel was all but helpless.

Since we don't know how good Kizaru works when cornered, all we really have to work with are the differences of their devilfruit.. meaning who has the most advantages in techniques and weapons etc.

[yoahl]

im proving that enel has great knowledge but some of you just don't accept it. some of you also claiming that you can make maxim that's impossible maxim has complicated motors and blueprint just accept it, you cant make it if you no have tremendous knowledge. im starting to think that you can't accept it even if it has proven, it probably that your just playing hard to get or hard to understand things to make enel great knowledge false. just accept it, Now im saying that enel has more knowledge(if your smart you can think several strategy) and more tactician fighter than kizaru.

We have too little info on how Kizaru would react if pressured. We know that Enel is good at changing tactics, as he did with Luffy, but there were several places where he showed the weakness of his mantra; he depends on it to a fault. Unlike Lucci, who could reach the trajectory of Luffy's punches, Enel was all but helpless. lol i bet enel can defeat lucci easily. yeah enel changes his tactics if one of his tactic wont work. Now you have said it, it means his a cunning fighter for being changing his tactics if he was at disadvantage.

Also we have not also seen all about enel. now we all know strawhat improves alot since skypeia arc. Enel having experiencing intense battle for the first time might give him a lesson and improves too same like straw hat crew having experiencing hard battle they have improve. Hope oda will make enel back to the grand line to see his improvements. i know enel is not a perfect fighter because of lack of experience but if he learn a lesson to his previous fight to straw hat we might see more dangerous enel.

Also dont be child like and just accept enel great knowledge. His a genius but did not want to expand his knowledge because of his dream.

so it would come down to a face-off, and Enel won't have the time to think if Kizaru attacks. You don't have the time to pause, regroup and figure out a new strategy once the enemy is upon you. I'm not saying Kizaru would do much better in that case, but the fact is that we don't know. dont count just speed with their fight, tactics is more important. like rayleigh and kizaru speed is not really the factor its tactics.

Sigart my friend did you visited the wiki i posted? what can you say? did you visited the website?

Also you say Kizaru is fast as light, when Reyligh can catch up to him.
He cant see/react and think as fast as light. Actually he is slower than a turtle, he just stands there with his leg aiming for eternity. Rey is going easy on him, hed tak both him and Sentomaru on and drink ale afterwards
lol i have read aokiji vs kizaru and found something interesting. yeah she is right not because kizaru is fast that doesnt mean he cant react that fast kizaru has also average reaction not a light speed reaction. i think because of his average reaction rayliegh manage to hit him.

Sigart you really love kizaru good for you ^^, keep it up! i also saw your post defending kizaru against aokiji

[Vincent1875]

so you dont know how to make maxim? lol how sad enel can haha....
I can't make the maxim because we don't exactly know what it is. We know it's a large flying ship with lots of gold, gears, and breath or jet dials on the bottom. If I had the jet engines, the slaves, the motors, and the unlimited energy, then yes I can make a ship fly. As for making it better. I'm possitive that the thing would have burst into flames after the sunlight hit it outside the atmosphere.
lol so you can read it. tell me how? lol your genius if you can tell me how? also what about the paintings? can you explain it? It's not possibly to read paintings(unless the painting has words in it). I however can understand it. How? Because I'm not an idiot, and the person who created it was human and wanted his fans to understand it.

yeah enel changes his tactics if one of his tactic wont work. Now you have said it, it means his a cunning fighter for being changing his tactics if he was at disadvantage. That was more common sense than tactics. ANY one in the world, but the stupidest, would have done the same thing. He was basically saying 'this doesn't work. let's try this then'. I don't see superior tactical skills there.

Also dont be child like and just accept enel great knowledge. His a genius but did not want to expand his knowledge because of his dream. Franky built the Sunny Go which is a much larger accomplishment, so I guess that means he's a genius too. You should accept the fact that Enel hasn't shown evidence of a large amount of knowledge on a subject that doesn't directly deal with him.

dont count just speed with their fight, tactics is more important. like rayleigh and kizaru speed is not really the factor its tactics. Tactics do not cancel out speed. Rayleigh was suppressing Kizaru's df powers, so we can't say he was even going his fastest. Rayleigh also didn't just use tactics in his fight. His experience matchs Kizaru's, his speed is blinding, his Haki was suppressing Kizaru's DF powers, and those together with his tactics evened out the playing field. Enel doesn't have half of those, so it can't be said he can repeat Rayleigh's performance.

The facts are: Kizaru is vastly faster. Kizaru is more experienced. Enel's power seems slightly more destructive.

This, with the barrel idea, brings Kizaru the win.

One Piece 470 page 01 | One Manga Link takes you to the page after the one I want you to see.

[Vongola X]

if its just destructive power they could be even but we dont know how strong kizaru strongest attack would be so it could be even stronger.
and enel needs time and the arc to create his strongest attack to destroy skypiea whilst kizaru destroys a grove in an instant (even if it isnt his goal)
so i think kizaru is probably stronger
but that of course doesnt mean he'd win for sure...could be a fight without a winner since its logia against logia

[Sigart]

I really dislike Kizaru, actually. If you wanna know. Defending him like this is a matter of logic for me.

I have visited the One Piece wikia on several occasions, although I'll admit that I haven't in this instance, since I know they base their descriptions of characters are based on what I have seen myself in manga and anime, and I feel confident enugh in my own ability to analyze characteristics to not need support from a third source.

[yoahl]

I really dislike Kizaru, actually. If you wanna know. Defending him like this is a matter of logic for me.

I have visited the One Piece wikia on several occasions, although I'll admit that I haven't in this instance, since I know they base their descriptions of characters are based on what I have seen myself in manga and anime, and I feel confident enugh in my own ability to analyze characteristics to not need support from a third source. in short enel knoweledge is not fiction its for real.

That was more common sense than tactics. ANY one in the world, but the stupidest, would have done the same thing. He was basically saying 'this doesn't work. let's try this then'. I don't see superior tactical skills there. but to pick accurate tactics makes him smart. not all can think that fast and accurate if he was at disadvantage. like shikamru he thinks 200 possible moves in 10seconds and picks one that is best in 1 sec. picking accurate tactics is a smart thing.

The facts are: Kizaru is vastly faster. Kizaru is more experienced. Enel's power seems slightly more destructive.
yeah kizaru is fast as light but his reaction is not, his reaction is average. you wanna know why? review rayliegh and kizaru fight. also add enel has more knowledge and more smarter fighter than kizaru is a fact too.

Franky built the Sunny Go which is a much larger accomplishment, so I guess that means he's a genius too. You should accept the fact that Enel hasn't shown evidence of a large amount of knowledge on a subject that doesn't directly deal with him. i do believe franky is genius. is he not? his not stupid though funny. i mean his the student of tom that makes the ship of Gol D. Roger. also he manage to repair himself. so same as enel his also genius just accept. though i believe enel is smarter than franky, i think enel and Nico Robin was like similar in IQ. i mean robin and enel concluded the same thing that Shandorian Golden Belfry Bell is not on the upper yard but beyond that. just read one piece wiki man and tell whats wrong their about enel knowledge?

Barrel idea makes me laugh lol... barrel is made of metal so enel can change its property... lets just drop this idea because all of DF user are weak in seawater...

[rikie3333]

Its rather easy, bring a diamond with you for Kizaru, and see how his leg shatters. (Diamond shatters light) Big weakness of him is that he cannot react fast enough to stop prolly. Enel is slower wich makes him more powerfull, since he is able to react towards a situation.

[ProDeathblow]

any form of light reflection would probably counter kizaru's power, i can't think of anything else

[yoahl]

oh yeah gold can reflect light if enel just make his golden staff into a big golden shield which he can. also enel has a mantra together with his golden staff. kizaru will be in danger lol.

here i searched the web and it said gold can reflect light. READ THE LAST PART
Reflecting Light
One of light's most useful characteristics is that it moves in a straight line. When you hold up a lighting instrument, the light shines where you point it. If you place a smooth reflective surface in the beam, the light will bounce off the reflector at the same angle that you have positioned the reflector. If the reflector is set at a 45-degree angle in front of the light, the light will hit the reflector and bounce off at a 45-degree angle from the reflector or 90 degrees from the light. It's much like shooting pool. You look at the reflector as if it is the side of the table and angle your shot so that the light goes towards your intended target. You can also use multiple smooth-surface reflectors in much the same way you would use a double bank-shot to get your light into hard to reach places (see the Let the Sun Shine In sidebar.)

Another handy characteristic of light is that it will reflect color off a surface. Reflect the light off a green wall and it will be green. Shine the light on a blue surface and it will reflect blue. To warm up a scene, you could reflect the light off a gold surface to light your subject in a golden glow.

because of this enel can reflect kizaru attacks and makes kizaru at a very big disadvantage. KIZARU just got pawned by ENEL!!!


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